...

vvrotny: @jimpax we will have one cart of tablet in MS next year. Hope to be 1:1 with tablets in 7th and 8th grade in 2009

matt montagne: @clarence...I've been following your progress with the eeePCs since you got those last spring...again, the value of working transparently!!

Susan Morgan: @jenwagner Currently students lease to own (2 years) We are looking at other options tho, more flexibility

fceblog: @matt ownership

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JimPAX: @Vinnie Are you getting this about the WayCom? ; )

KarenJan: am interested to see a comparison between a class set of Asus EEEs & laptops - what do the students think?

JenWagner: @susanmorgan -- at the end of two years, the computer is theirs?? That is a good idea. Do they get the software as well??

Susan Morgan: @deacs84 I'd love to know more when you get info

JimPAX: @Vinnie Reall???!! That is spectacular!

JenWagner: Vinnie -- you are at ONE school?? or do you work throughout the district??

Susan Morgan: @jenwagner Yes, the computer is theirs...I'm not sure about all software (I don't do that:)) I think some is removed?

matt montagne: @fceblog...ownership is big...I think sutdents really like to be able to customize their workshpace and call it their own...who doesn't acutally! Imagine if teachers had to go to the lab to use a computer, or wait till the laptop cart came into their room to work. We all like having our own, customizeable digital workspace

JenWagner: and @susan -- you are Mac/PC/ both??

vvrotny: @jimpax often hard to catch all of the f2f conversation and chat, but will check out resources on wacom

Susan Morgan: Currently PC but we are playing with a couple of Macs this year :)

KarenJan: @matt - agree completely

JenWagner: @matt -- That is SOOOO true

matt montagne: @KarenJan...I like the idea of student/family chocie...let them pick the platform

vvrotny: @jen one campus - jk-12

JenWagner: we had teachers change rooms --- they wanted to take their computer (which is on the network) with them

Susan Morgan: @matt I do too. Hope we move to that

JenWagner: to their new room

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JenWagner: @Vinnie -- thanks, That is what I thought :)

Robin Ellis: @matt having choice is a great idea

vvrotny: @jen to start the program, we are currently looking at school lease to parents

matt montagne: @susan...but most IT folks really want to standardize, which I kind of understand...but on the flipside, all we really need now is a browswer and internet connection

JenWagner: I am looking at options for my school --

cfisher: @matt a wiki I made for my school district is here: http://frontierlict.wikispaces.com/ has more info on our eee pilot project

JenWagner: so than kyou EVERYONE

KarenJan: what is this conference, BTW? Pulls in JackieB, Ehelfant, Vvrotny & Darren

matt montagne: thanks cfish...

Susan Morgan: @matt Absolutely. B/c I work online, when I got my Mac, all I had to do was login into Google!

KarenJan: Clarence are you there or in the chat virtually?

JenWagner: we applied for the SAMSUNG grant -- anyone else??

matt montagne: @susan...and then if your organization can standardize on some Free and Open source solutions, then everyone can be using the same software tools...

JenWagner: Full mobile lab plus $$$$ and (lol) a dog

fceblog: @matt I have to book a room with 4 PCs in advance. Arrive earlier, let the people in tech department whatever is not working... Start working hoping they'll arrive. They do. I stop sweating. Log into wiki and go! Laptop will not arrive to my classroom unless I buy one myself. Thinking about it. Kind of expensive here.

vvrotny: @robin and @matt as matt and I have spoken about keeping everything consistent to build the program at first. Levels the playing field for certain students

matt montagne: ...democratizes the software computing experience....

cfisher: @karenjan I am in Edmonton AB back with my family after BLC. This is Darren's gig

KarenJan: @vvrotny - then they need to build their own toolbelt

JenWagner: KarenJan -- I need to know more about this toolbelt

Deacs84: @matt I do agree with you...

fceblog: toolbelt... nice words

KarenJan: Must be good to be home - how was the visit at Alan's?

Susan Morgan: @matt That's the plan.

Robin Ellis: @vvrotny I can understand that do you provide support for home use as well?

vvrotny: this is a workshop for teachers, given by darren for the teachers in @ehelfant's school. @jackieb and myself were graciously invited to participate. Road trip to STL was worth the opportunity to learn f2f with Darren

JenWagner: Everyone knows that Kevin Honeycutt posted the template for his keychain -- RIGHT??

KarenJan: @fcblog - can't take any credit - got it from Ira Socol - http://speedchange.blogspot.com/2008/05/toolbelt-theory-for-everyone.html

matt montagne: we are at an unprecedented time period with relationship to software options...never b4 have we had some much free and powerful software available to us...why not use it!!

Deacs84: @cf Yes, do tell about your trip out to Marblehead,,,,

Justin Reeve: I started a list of open source tools for the classroom here: http:/http://blog.weber.k12.ut.us/jreeve/breakdown-of-an-open-source-school/

JenWagner: Thanks @KarenJan -- I delicioused it

Justin Reeve: The idea being that I'd cover all the aspects of setting up tech for a school eventually. Still needs some work. Might be better as a wiki actually!

cfisher: @karen night at Alan's place was good. Beautiful spot right on the Atlantic, but had to leave early in the AM. Still managed to miss my flight though

KarenJan: @jen - yes, it's a keeper - I reference it all the time

KarenJan: oh, no!

fceblog: @KarenJan Thanks!

vvrotny: @robin if we want to embed and create the expetation of using this 24/7, which is where teaching and leanring occur, we will have to provide support. Something that we are struggling with, but glad we don't do our rollout for a year

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vvrotny: @jen no, url?

cfisher: @Deacs84 pictures to follow....

Justin Reeve: what school districts need to start doing is hiring proactive tech specialists, those who can take things in new directions.

cfisher: not to mention the bottle and a half of scotch we managed to drink

Robin Ellis: @vvrotny I agree if expecting use 24/7 must support

KarenJan: that explains missing the flight @cfisher

fceblog: Hey! I hear tango music. ;-)

Justin Reeve: I guess that's an obvious statement, but what I would do if i were hiring, is I check a person's online profile as well as look at their experience on their resume

fceblog: That's called Libertango

KarenJan: @justin - what do you do - will you open that open source school soon?

JenWagner: @vvrotny -- et me grab it

vvrotny: Darren getting ready to present OLE, Orchestrating a Learning Encology

Justin Reeve: if they have a pretty well-established online presence, I think that often says something about what direction they're heading

JenWagner: http://kevinhoneycutt.org/ THERE YOU GO

Bud Hunt: @Justin - an interesting dilemma, though - do we push or support? Seems like we don't want to take educators in directions that they don't want to go - but we also want to do some visioning.

JenWagner: Got to get back to my job. Thanks everyone and enjoy your day!!!!!

vvrotny: @fceblog darren said that he added the tango just for you!

KarenJan: great seeing you again @jenw!

Justin Reeve: @KarenJan er, probably not. I've been helping with a charter school and we're doing quite a bit with open source. That was the original inspiration for the list. But I'm not going to be continuing to help with that after school starts.

Justin Reeve: There are actually many good reasons NOT to use some of those tools. But for schools on a very tight budget, I do think open source solutions should be evaluated first.

fceblog: @vvrotny The day I travel to meet you all, I'll provide the tango dancing basic lesson. ;-) I might as well persuade you to come all the way to Buenos Aires and breathe tango for yourselves. I'll tour you. Promise.

KarenJan: @fceblog - will you be coming to the states any time soon?

Justin Reeve: for example, you can install LTSP and use Edubuntu desktops throughout your school. But then you have to deal with teachers and parents who don't like it because it's "not what they're used to."

cfisher: @Justin please explain "many good reasons not to use these tools."

matt montagne: @justin...I think FOSS should be considered even at "affluent" schools...even these schools have equity issues, and FOSS deals with those beautifully

Justin Reeve: They often use the term "not user-friendly" but what they really mean is "not what I'm used to." In other words, you have to also consider the fact you'll be training them.

Justin Reeve: oh I agree, matt

fceblog: @KarenJan Nope, I'm afraid. But the day I plan to travel I'll tweet it ;-)

Justin Reeve: it should ALWAYS be evaluated first, before any commercial solutions

Deacs84: Sorry, had to drop out for a few. Excited teacher showed up in my office. Like that...a lot...

Justin Reeve: sorry, didn't mean to imply it should ONLY be considered at strapped-budget schools

KarenJan: @deacs84 - do share!

fceblog: la marca, yes

vvrotny: @fceblog I look forward to that day

KarenJan: we need to share successes as often as possible

Justin Reeve: anyway, in some cases, it might simply be less headache to use Windows thin clients with ThinStation and Server 2003/2008, than LTSP

fceblog: When tango is danced well, neither dancer can tell for sure who is leading who. Magic.

KarenJan: I had two great successes last week with two different students

Bud Hunt: @fceblog: I don't believe I've ever danced it well, then.

fceblog: @Bud didn't know you had tried...

Bud Hunt: Well, I do prefer to play music than dance to it. It's not pretty.

Justin Reeve: or that Endian Firewall. The web filter uses DansGuardian and SquidGuard. Excellent filter. But doesn't integrate as well with LDAP as it could. if you want a setup that gives you a simple straightforward group that lets you assign "override privileges" to an entire group, such as teachers, so they can show YouTube videos whenever they want but students can't, you'll need something like Symantics (I think that's what it's called)

fceblog: What instrument do you play?

cfisher: @Justin anyone who has ever used the latest version of Office compared to anything previous has had to do just as much learning as switching from Office to Open office

Bud Hunt: Stringed stuff. Guitars. Mandolins. Basses. Nothing fancy.

matt montagne: someone out there using FirstClass?? heard the first class mail "ding"

JimPAX: Alright all, I actually have to get back to working on my own curriculum. I'll check back later.

Justin Reeve: and for just a few hundred you can invest in a quality Cisco firewall. That's what Cisco does best, and it might just be worth choosing that over an open source software-based filter like Endian, which is naturally slower.

Justin Reeve: exactly, @cfisher. That's what I tell people.

Justin Reeve: And frankly, I'm starting to say "Just move to online docs."

Robin Ellis: great morning everyone have a meeting to get to, thanks for the great conversations

Justin Reeve: that's how document authoring will take place in the future.

cfisher: I had 5 XP eee pcs and 5 Linux when they were first in my classroom. Within 2 weeks the kids wanted them all switched over to Linux because it was different and let them look at things in a new way

Deacs84: @karenjan I've worked with him for a year, and we rebuilt this summer. He's rebuilding his world geography class to focus on global issues. Students will use RSS feeds to look at global issues from varying perspectives, will then reflect and take turns creating weekly podcasts. Also will have students collaborate on researching a global issue, and we will build toward film festival for movies they will create. We're also working towards true digital storytelling fesitval in 8th grade--graduation pieces

Justin Reeve: eventually we'll see MS Office and OpenOffice start to dissolve, at least on the desktop

cfisher: @Deacs84 very cool. Seems like people are finally beginning to appreciate the idea of RSS and free on demand, updated information

Bud Hunt: @Justin - Eventually? It's already happening. Isn't the new Office file structure XML?

KarenJan: sounds ambitious and very project-based!

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cfisher: that model is coming through in a few places - loving the potential of igoogle tabs for a class

Justin Reeve: sure, Bud. We'll see it on a much more massive scale in the coming years, though.

Justin Reeve: and eventually all new releases of OpenOffice and MS Office will be online-only

vvrotny: @deacs84 our world geography and modern european teachers are reshuffling the entire two year sequence. Seems real similar to what you are doing. Testing a few untils this year, full rollout in 2009-2010

Justin Reeve: imo, Zoho is better than Google Docs

Justin Reeve: though buggier

matt montagne: @Deacs84...that does sound like a fantastic project in waiting...are you at a 1-1 school?? Would you say your curriculum is fairly "classical?"

cfisher: uh oh. Did you see that Joyce has her super powers video from BLC posted

KarenJan: better but buggier - isn't that an oxymoron?

Bud Hunt: @Justin - I like Zoho - but my peeps are in Google Docs. So I stay there, mostly.

JackieB: Loving Darren's focus on metacognition.

fceblog: @bud That's the point. Instant use because everyone is already there. That's the killer feature.

Justin Reeve: I wonder if it's a publicly traded company. Zoho is certainly one to watch, because you just know it'll be bought by a large company soon. Possibly Yahoo!

KarenJan: @cfisher - yup, watched it, also watched the final BLC reflections video

Justin Reeve: yeah, Google Docs is the way to go right now. Especially since you can install it on your own domain.

Bud Hunt: @fceblog: Right. But not "EVERYONE" is there. Yet. Of course, invitations are cheap and sharing is good motivation to create accounts.

Justin Reeve: Maybe not Yahoo! They're going down the tube.

matt montagne: @jackie...I do too...real value in getting students to slow down and reflect on their own learning...challenging in an environment where everyone feels compelled to blast thru content

vvrotny: @cfisher yes, just say the tweet. I cannot wait to watch this one

JackieB: @matt Blasting thru doesn't mean anyone is learning. (but you know that. :-) )

fceblog: I always wondered about gdocs. When you share, can either party choose to delete the doc or just the person who created it?

Bud Hunt: @fceblog: That's a good question. Never thought 'bout it. Want to try?

fceblog: yup

fceblog: When you share there is a feature to allow other to add people. I do not know how much power that gives you.

matt montagne: @jackie--this is where i think systemic scheduling changes need to take place in schools...a very traditional, 45 minute teaching block supports content based learning...longer blocks create the potential for more project based learning. So obvious, but many schools are still setup with that short instructinal block...

matt montagne: ...and trying to change schedules at a school is kind of like ________ (fill in the blank)

matt montagne: ...I'll just say that trying to make schedule changes in schools is flat out painful

ehelfant: @matt montagne - we are doing tablet training by having a week long interdisciplinary unit with a totally different schedule..will be fun and interesting to try

KarenJan: @matt - always wonder about that one - 7 45 minute periods is unlike anything else in real life - especially college where you may have one or two one hour classes a day

LangLabCindy: @matt also heard it said that trying to change a history course is harder than changing the course of history

Bud Hunt: It's funny - Darren re-wrote our wiki - and made it better - and still gives me credit.

matt montagne: @LangLabCindy...great quote!!! Never heard that one b4...

matt montagne: @KarenJan...I've submitted before that it is really, really, really difficult to infuse technology into the classroom experience in that type of block. It is a real challenge for the average teacher...

Deacs84: @matt We are moving to 1:1. My focus has been to help the middle school "get ready" and so we've got labs, 4 laptop carts, etc. School has a progressive pedagogy "founding" but like many very competitive private schools has been trapped in traditional methods, AP/SAT madness, etc

KarenJan: @deacs84 - have thought about starting an organization called, "Parents Against the SAT" - I encouraged my son NOT to take the SAT and he listened!

Deacs84: @matt My goal has been to focus on the pedagogy while experimenting with the tools. Sometimes I've found we've had to play with the tools in a traditional sense before the leap is made to the student-centered, inquiry-driven model

matt montagne: chedk out dean shareski's recent slidecast on students creating a digital footprint online...it is a really fresh slant on "online safety" type of presentation

LangLabCindy: @matt Heard it at Lausanne conf last year - attributed to Lou Salza. And Woodrow Wilson in 1921: It is easier to change the location of a cemetary than to change a school curriculum." So, long-standing issues!

Deacs84: @karenjan My alma mater, Wake Forest, just took a big step and announced they no longer required SAT or ACT!

matt montagne: @karenjan...how did that affect the college admissions process for your son??

KarenJan: love it - more college are going that route

fceblog: @bud Ok I'll try to delete yours. You try to unpublish mine.

matt montagne: @Descs84...really?? That is so cool about Wake!

Bud Hunt: @fceblog: Ok.

Deacs84: Yep. Wake and Smith

matt montagne: @Deacs84...I was never much of a Deacons fan b4...now I am!!! :-)

Bud Hunt: @fceblog: Your document, according to me, is not published.

KarenJan: @matt - he is still figuring out what he will do next with his life, I follow the 40 Colleges that Change Lives model

Deacs84: Will do PERSONAL INTERVIEWS

Bud Hunt: @fceblog: Unpublished.

Deacs84: @matt So maybe now everyone will get my "Deacs84"

LangLabCindy: @KarenJan - what is 40 colleges that change lives model?

KarenJan: Wake Forest Deacons? what is a deacon in a non church sense???

fceblog: @Bud I deleted your doc.

Bud Hunt: @fceblog: Looks like deleting only deletes your collaboration.

matt montagne: @Deacs84...I think so...by the way, just joking about Wake...I've always been a Wake fan, especially when they are playing Duke!!

Bud Hunt: @fceblog: Which makes sense. You've lost it - but I've still got it.

Deacs84: No kidding...

fceblog: @Bud Interesting. Let me check the other doc now.

KarenJan: @langlab great book that all parents need to read as their kids embark on the college search process http://tinyurl.com/5wurnl

Deacs84: @karenjan Wake used to be a Baptist school, and the elders in the church were Deacons. That is where they got that name. Ever heard the Steely Dan song? Yep, that's us.

KarenJan: @deacs84 - now it makes sense

LangLabCindy: @KarenJan Thanks for the link!

fceblog: @Bud the doc I created remains published.

matt montagne: I'm still struggling with picking a school-wide, unified blogging platform for students and teachers...there are pros and cons with every solution out there...

Bud Hunt: @fceblog: Hmm. I thought I unpublished it.

Deacs84: OK, now I have to do the long list of things I have to do today. Much rather stay here and listen and chat. Cheers to all for now. @cf: Looking forward to seeing those pics. (BTW, did you see Joyce's video yet?? Oh my...) @Bud we missed you at BLC, but I'll ring if Will (my son) needs anything this week....he would definitely think you "ROCK"; @vinny Missed you as well at BLC;Let's chat PLP soon...Cheers all!

KarenJan: bye Laura!

matt montagne: chow deacs84

Deacs84: @matt We're using Edublogs and also bringing in 21 Classrooms for certain cases...lots to figure out...

Bud Hunt: Take care, Laura.

Deacs84: Bye!

vvrotny: @deacs84 we will be in touch

cfisher: me too. Gotta get my truck washed and my kids out of the house.

cfisher: bye all

fceblog: Question to all: How do you introduce a new tool? 'Get yourself an account, you'll need it for our class' or... 'We are going to be sharing things in this class AND we need a new account in...' I mean, what's the starting point?

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matt montagne: chow cfish

vvrotny: @cfisher have a great day

Bud Hunt: @fceblog: Depends on the tool and the group. I find that I think really hard about which tools folks HAVE to use.

matt montagne: that is a question that comes up when showing delicious to folks..."can I make that private" Goes back to our initial conversation about the reticence of folks to working transparently...

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Bud Hunt: @matt - Yeah - but I use private saving, too. Even with transparency, some stuff's private.

vvrotny: @matt I use private saving. Somethings I get are private, internal docs that I get permission to look at but not share. Have to respect the rights of the creator

Bud Hunt: I've done plenty of searches that I wanted to save but not tell other people about.

Bud Hunt: jobs, medical, logistical, family stuff, travel, etc.

fceblog: Publishing means being ready to hear other voices, sometimes you need your quiet hour of thinking before sharing. That's the private phase for me.

JackieB: mulling over this garden anology.

LangLabCindy: @fceblog yes, always amazed that people can live blog

fceblog: Sometimes the moment you write to publish you think of a specific audience. That affects your writing. Sometimes you need to let your thoughts out. Then you see what is worth publishing and what for. Different ways.

LangLabCindy: Hugely important idea about caring for blog site and nurturing it and the community

Bud Hunt: @fceblog: The fancy name for all that thinking is rhetorical considerations.

Bud Hunt: Sounds cool, don't it?

matt montagne: Nice presentation Darren!!

matt montagne: Nice chatting w/ y'all!!

matt montagne: thanks to Liz and MICDS folks for sharing out this presentation...much appreciated

fceblog: @Bud Rhetorical considerations... That definitely upgrades such a simple thought of mine. ;-)

Bud Hunt: @fceblog: Always nice to have a three dollar word for something so important, huh?

fceblog: ROTFL

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Darren Kuropatwa: Here is the code to make the nav bar invisable

Darren Kuropatwa: #b-navbar { height:0px; visibility:hidden }

Darren Kuropatwa: body { position: relative; top: -32px; }

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